loose rivets
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loose rivets
I was adjusting the chain on my 65 this morning and noticed that the sprocket wasnt tight against drum (AGAIN). This seems to happen way to often and I dont even want to think about what would happen if it let go. Is it a good idea and or acceptable to just go with bolts and nuts? If it is, what size and grade of bolt should I use. Thanks Wick
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If the holes for the rivets in the drum are over sized or just out of spec's , new rivets will not last long. Even if you think the assembly is tight , the rivets need a snug fit in the drum and sprocket. I have seen the holes in drum/sprocket in a slight oblong state and in that condition , they don't hold up. Also look for cracks , very small ones. Finding a good NOS/OEM replacement my be difficult. As far as repairing it , others may know a proper way to do that here .
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The clearance between the backing plate and the drum will not allow for anything but a well-pressed rivet to fit.
Rivets that have been peened instead of pressed often do not swell to occupy the eccentricities of worn holes.
Although it looks cheesy, a lot of drums are drilled with the sprocket rotated a few degrees for a fresh start. It would still be safer than some horrible repops.
....Cotten
Rivets that have been peened instead of pressed often do not swell to occupy the eccentricities of worn holes.
Although it looks cheesy, a lot of drums are drilled with the sprocket rotated a few degrees for a fresh start. It would still be safer than some horrible repops.
....Cotten
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Re: loose rivets
I can tell you from experience exactly what will happen when the rivits all let go - you let the clutch out and don't go anywherewaymon85 wrote:I was adjusting the chain on my 65 this morning and noticed that the sprocket wasnt tight against drum (AGAIN). This seems to happen way to often and I dont even want to think about what would happen if it let go. Is it a good idea and or acceptable to just go with bolts and nuts? If it is, what size and grade of bolt should I use. Thanks Wick
As others have said - if you don't have the right equipment to smush the rivit enough to expand and completely fill the hole it will very quickly work loose again. (also learned by experience).
I just drilled out the holes slightly and put screws and nuts in instead of rivits. I think they are about #8 stainless socket head cap screws with nyloc nuts.
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There is place for nut and bolt.Cotten wrote:The clearance between the backing plate and the drum will not allow for anything but a well-pressed rivet to fit.
Rivets that have been peened instead of pressed often do not swell to occupy the eccentricities of worn holes.
Although it looks cheesy, a lot of drums are drilled with the sprocket rotated a few degrees for a fresh start. It would still be safer than some horrible repops.
....Cotten
Pandit
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Pandit!
Where's the room for a bolt head or nut in the first pic?
The backing plate will hit even riviets if they are not pressed enough.
That's a post '58 assembly of course.
The second pic shows both sides of a mechanical drum, and as you can see, there isn't room on either side, without eliminating the dust ring, and severely compromising the flange.
It should be clear why the Factory used ~3/16" rivets.
....Cotten
Where's the room for a bolt head or nut in the first pic?
The backing plate will hit even riviets if they are not pressed enough.
That's a post '58 assembly of course.
The second pic shows both sides of a mechanical drum, and as you can see, there isn't room on either side, without eliminating the dust ring, and severely compromising the flange.
It should be clear why the Factory used ~3/16" rivets.
....Cotten
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- DRUMRVT1.jpg (47.7 KiB) Viewed 2557 times
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JustDave!
Here's a pic of a 'home-made' press anvil for riveting sprockets; It is very much like the Factory tool in that it has a means of holding the drum down at its center.
The punch on the press ram is a sawn-off motor valve with the stem cut concave on the end. It is held to the ram with a stupidglide fork boot.
The supporting pedestal under the rivet also has a concave dimple in it to accept the rivet head.
....Cotten
Here's a pic of a 'home-made' press anvil for riveting sprockets; It is very much like the Factory tool in that it has a means of holding the drum down at its center.
The punch on the press ram is a sawn-off motor valve with the stem cut concave on the end. It is held to the ram with a stupidglide fork boot.
The supporting pedestal under the rivet also has a concave dimple in it to accept the rivet head.
....Cotten
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- SPKTRIVT.jpg (54.43 KiB) Viewed 2554 times
I did manage to get four 3/16 button head bolts through the sprocket and drum and tighten them down with nylon locking nuts (button head on the anchor plate side). Beat the hell out of the rivets that were left.The drum and srocket doesnt ride against the brake shoe anchor plate on my 65. I dont see how it could with the plate being statoinary and the drum rotating.There is a gap of about 3/16 between the two. The wheel spins freely with this set up and there is still about 1/16 to spare. I will replace all the rivets with bolts if this works long term.
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Wick5!
If you have 3/16" of an inch clearance between the backing plate and the sprocket, Don't ride on gravel!
Sounds like a parts mismatch or a spacing concern.
....Cotten
PS: Most folks call a 3/16" fastener a #12 screw. Unless they were shanked exactly the same as the thickness of the flange and sprocket, the threads will either mush, or tear their way deeper.
If you have 3/16" of an inch clearance between the backing plate and the sprocket, Don't ride on gravel!
Sounds like a parts mismatch or a spacing concern.
....Cotten
PS: Most folks call a 3/16" fastener a #12 screw. Unless they were shanked exactly the same as the thickness of the flange and sprocket, the threads will either mush, or tear their way deeper.
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I fasten the sprocket with #12 slotted panhead machine screws and self locking nuts. Never had a problem and sure is alot easier than rivets. Unless some one is going all original. Why hassle with the rivets? With no more horse power than our stock pans put out , sorry but its true, there is no way to shear 20 screws. Is there?
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Cotten,
Have you got a pic of an end view of your punch? How much did you dish the valve stem? What did you use?, a round stone on a dremmel? Has the ram held up pretty good or have had to refresh the concave surface occasionally?
I've got a drawer full of old valves, I'm making one of those this weekend!
mike
Have you got a pic of an end view of your punch? How much did you dish the valve stem? What did you use?, a round stone on a dremmel? Has the ram held up pretty good or have had to refresh the concave surface occasionally?
I've got a drawer full of old valves, I'm making one of those this weekend!
mike