Frame identification help needed

[paniekstra]

Hello,

I ran into what is - according to the paperwork– a 1972 Electra Glide, but the VIN is bogus and the steering head has some forge markings that are unknown to me.

Do you have an idea what I might have here?

Many thanks in advance.

Regards,

Rob

[Speeding Big Twin]

I don’t know who or what those forging markings represent. Can you post photos of the rest of the frame please. Thanks.

Re the frame VIN, I can’t tell much from the picture but perhaps it is an assigned number? Some countries/states assign a certain number to an aftermarket frame for registration purposes. Or does the frame number follow the normal 1972 H-D format? If so, maybe someone used a 72 Harley frame number on that frame? Can you post a better photo of the frame VIN.

And can you post a partial photo of the engine number.
Did you check the belly numbers? Photos?
Is anything stamped on top of the cases near the rear mounting bolts? Photos?
Eric

[paniekstra]

Thanks Eric and sorry for my late reply, I have been relocating.

The VIN was not factory stamped, but follows the 2A@@@@@H2 convention for a 1972 Electra Glide to match the paperwork. The engine serial was also not factory stamped and somewhat follows the convention for a Police Electra Glide. The belly numbers are orginal and follow 178 @@@ @@@, being a 74 CID 1978 Shovel with a julian day number and a daily sequence number.

The left posts reads 47654 65 (without a dot or a hyphen), de right post ends with a dot and 58 (10). The round swingarm has a (crisp) 47606-58 marking on the right. Pics are attached.

My best guess is that is either a replica frame or an original frame with a replaced steering head.

Look forward to your thoughts.

Thanks.

Rob

[Speeding Big Twin]

Cheers Rob. I agree at least the steering head seems to be aftermarket. Even though the frame VIN is not factory, is it within the accepted production range? NB: if the VIN is extremely high (for example, around 90000s) it may have originally been assigned to a replacement H-D frame and then someone used it on that aftermarket steering head.

Engine number not factory-stamped but somewhat follows the convention for a police Electra Glide? Do you mean it begins with 1A? Sometimes even H-D Service Bulletins suggest 1As are police models but AFAIK anyone could buy them, not just police.

Re the 178 number, I imagine the left case has it underneath? But where is it on the R-H case? Inside the gear compartment?

There is also other ID to look for. Under the left case near the 178 number, is there anything else? For example A123? And if so, is the same extra ID stamped under the R-H case? Otherwise look at the back of the cases. For example this 78 Super Glide has U4++ on both cases.

Crankcase ID.jpg

Your lower left forging number 47654 65 looks the normal style used on a Harley frame and it also looks like you have gusset plate #47261-68 which was fitted as original as of about mid-68 models. But what has been welded to the back of the forging? Maybe a footpeg bracket?
Forging number 47654 65 was used for about mid-70 thru early-73. (I do not know for certain why the suffix was 65 but that is what happened.) Here’s an example for comparison.

Lower left rear forging.jpg

Re your R-H forging number, I imagine the first five characters are 47651? They were used for 58 thru early-73. After the 58 are you sure the number is 10? Or could it be 16?
Notice at the back of the forging the boss has been drilled. The boss wasn’t required after 64 but it was left in the forging thru early-73 anyway. Some very early 65s had it drilled (and tapped), apparently because they were leftover pieces from 64.

Has your frame got a date code?

Are the upper rear forging numbers 47645-65? Or 47645-65Y (aka 47645-65-Y)?

Re the swingarm, the R-H axle clip apparently had forging number EX2039 for the 58 prototype and maybe (?) some very early 58 production models. But it soon changed to 47606-58 which then continued thru 72. (Instead of the hyphen some have a dot.) Also notice forging hallmark Q with WF inside it although I do not know what company it represents. Die number looks like 73? Or 78?
Left axle clip may have ID outside. Inside the left clip you may find forging number 47614-58B and a die number.
Here’s a link to my thread on 58–72 BT swingarms.
Eric


H-D Big Twin round-tube swingarms 1958–72