Samwel v-tronic
-
- Member
- Posts: 217
- Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:07 pm
- Bikes: Panhead FL 1960
- Has thanked: 22 times
- Been thanked: 20 times
Samwel v-tronic
What is your opinion and experience of the Samwel v-tronic for the panhead?, has it worked well for you? I find the instructions a bit confusing and I have not found many experiences with it.
Regards
Regards
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 890
- Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:01 pm
- Bikes: '61 Pan
'83 FXWG
'74 T150
'41 Indian, '29Norton
'25 HD
'13 JAP
'12 BSA,
'11&'12 NH
'08 Triumph - Location: NZ
- Has thanked: 509 times
- Been thanked: 366 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
Good to hear. Which type is yours? Manual advance? Is it the blue or orange module and are these the same anyway? Thanks.
-
- Member
- Posts: 475
- Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:09 am
- Bikes: 1951 FL
- Location: Germany
- Has thanked: 85 times
- Been thanked: 231 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
Here: '51 with standard 74cui motor
12V - manual advance - electronic regulator - 6Amps sealed battery - 5 Ohm Dyna coil - copper wires - non resistant plugs - Champion RL82YC
2 different models available
-48
49 and up
The early one used to be a blue module with 2 wires and its own rotor ( I believe that this module is now orange as well and has 3 wires too)
The late one is an orange module with 3 wires and its own rotor.
FYI
I have no comparison to a Pan with a pointer iggie !
With my kick-only shovelchop I borrowed various types of electronic iggies and except for one I was never 100% happy
and so I kept happily the pointer in the shovelhead for far more than 120K
I have the blue module (2 wires) with the late rotor
This late rotor is stamped with a number on the inside. The early one is not stamped at all.
The bike came with the early rotor (non stamped) and it started and ran. Sluggish but she was running.
It took me a while to understand that I am having the wrong rotor installed ...
After swapping to the late rotor the bike is running nice.
Provided everything else is ok the bike starts cold, warm and hot latest on the second kick.
And I am "slow in motion kicker"
After repair, overhaul and reassembly I managed ~3500mls with this bike and this ignition
Twice, I was stucked in the mother of traffic jam in high temps. The iggie didn`t cut out what so ever
I rode straight for 5hrs thru heavy rain with low temps, no worries.
Just as someone would expect
This electronic iggie is easy to install, easy to adjust and easy to check.
But I`m not buying it that you can swap back to points in 10min in case this iggie is giving up LOL no way
There are certainly other iggies which are equally good but this type does what I need.
I am happy
Ray
12V - manual advance - electronic regulator - 6Amps sealed battery - 5 Ohm Dyna coil - copper wires - non resistant plugs - Champion RL82YC
2 different models available
-48
49 and up
The early one used to be a blue module with 2 wires and its own rotor ( I believe that this module is now orange as well and has 3 wires too)
The late one is an orange module with 3 wires and its own rotor.
FYI
I have no comparison to a Pan with a pointer iggie !
With my kick-only shovelchop I borrowed various types of electronic iggies and except for one I was never 100% happy
and so I kept happily the pointer in the shovelhead for far more than 120K
I have the blue module (2 wires) with the late rotor
This late rotor is stamped with a number on the inside. The early one is not stamped at all.
The bike came with the early rotor (non stamped) and it started and ran. Sluggish but she was running.
It took me a while to understand that I am having the wrong rotor installed ...
After swapping to the late rotor the bike is running nice.
Provided everything else is ok the bike starts cold, warm and hot latest on the second kick.
And I am "slow in motion kicker"
After repair, overhaul and reassembly I managed ~3500mls with this bike and this ignition
Twice, I was stucked in the mother of traffic jam in high temps. The iggie didn`t cut out what so ever
I rode straight for 5hrs thru heavy rain with low temps, no worries.
Just as someone would expect
This electronic iggie is easy to install, easy to adjust and easy to check.
But I`m not buying it that you can swap back to points in 10min in case this iggie is giving up LOL no way
There are certainly other iggies which are equally good but this type does what I need.
I am happy
Ray
-
- Site Admin
- Senior Member
- Posts: 3291
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2001 12:00 pm
- Bikes: 1954 FL
- Location: Holland
- Has thanked: 108 times
- Been thanked: 488 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
I'm using mine since 2007, the blue one (there was no other one then) with manual advance.Good to hear. Which type is yours? Manual advance? Is it the blue or orange module and are these the same anyway? Thanks.
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 890
- Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:01 pm
- Bikes: '61 Pan
'83 FXWG
'74 T150
'41 Indian, '29Norton
'25 HD
'13 JAP
'12 BSA,
'11&'12 NH
'08 Triumph - Location: NZ
- Has thanked: 509 times
- Been thanked: 366 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
Supercool. Great information. Thanks team.
Ray, am with you on 5ohm coil, copper HT wires and non resistor plugs and caps. Much like how my Dyna S is set up. I like the idea 5 ohm doesn't work the breaker chip too hard, yet that same coil gives a better spark than it can do on points.
Keen to understand the difference between early and late rotors. Please snap a pic if you still have them both.
What plug gaps have you settled on? For comparison Dynatek recommends as follows: Will check my notes later to see what mine is currently... Dynatek seem somewhat non-committal so I suppose it's over to users to share what works and what doesn't.
Love your description of "swap back to points in 10mins". Sounds more like sales pitch or piss talk.
Am just about to post more thoughts on how to get maximum reliability from an electronic iggie (on probably the other thread)
Panhead, since 2007 (14 years) is very satisfactory. Bet you haven't missed fiddling with points in that time...
Ray, am with you on 5ohm coil, copper HT wires and non resistor plugs and caps. Much like how my Dyna S is set up. I like the idea 5 ohm doesn't work the breaker chip too hard, yet that same coil gives a better spark than it can do on points.
Keen to understand the difference between early and late rotors. Please snap a pic if you still have them both.
What plug gaps have you settled on? For comparison Dynatek recommends as follows: Will check my notes later to see what mine is currently... Dynatek seem somewhat non-committal so I suppose it's over to users to share what works and what doesn't.
Love your description of "swap back to points in 10mins". Sounds more like sales pitch or piss talk.
Am just about to post more thoughts on how to get maximum reliability from an electronic iggie (on probably the other thread)
Panhead, since 2007 (14 years) is very satisfactory. Bet you haven't missed fiddling with points in that time...
-
- Member
- Posts: 475
- Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:09 am
- Bikes: 1951 FL
- Location: Germany
- Has thanked: 85 times
- Been thanked: 231 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
My setup isn`t chosen wisely. The iggie came with the bike and I okeyed it after brief look at the parts
I was busting knuckles on this bike almost every day for 18mths to get her somewhat running and I simply wanted to gooooo !
5 days before I left for my 2500mls shakedown ride I was messing with the trans on the bench for the 3rd time
So I didn`t care about getting the right coil, HT wires, plugs.
I knew that it will work for sure.
But I also knew then, that I won`t get the best performance reg fuel-milage, idle-control, etc.
But this is exactly the reason why I am happy with this iggie because I haven`t got anything to complain.
No fouled plugs, no kick backs, no pinging but we all know that a non leaking manifold is the crux
Yea, she is a gaz guzzling pig when loaded with a tent on the handlebar, sidebags, clothes and tools
and you need a sensible twist of the wrist to enjoy more than 33mpg.
Would I get a higher mileage with a proper setup ?
For sure !
It will be minor but that difference might save you from pushing 600lbs plus to the next gas station
Even with a gap too wide between module and rotor she works sweet (I didn`t want to file, drill at the base plate)
I was actually surprised about how well it works with a spark so timid
IMHO, a 2 or 3 Ohm coil with graphite HT leads combined with resistor plugs would be a wise choice for an electronic ignition.
It`s more a personal thing that I don`t like Dyna ignitions and that I don`t like graphite leads and I`m tired of Andrews coils which kept
on crapping out on me after less than 10.000 mls.
Naturally, always a 3 days ride from home in 100F and rush hour grrrr. I`m done with Andrews.
Regarding plugs:
Really, I don`t care who`s the manufacturer.
With the Shovel I never ever felt a difference wether it is Champion, Bosch, Beru or NGK. No Delco available here
It`s just the 14mm short thread and the proper heat range I`m looking for.
With the Pan and the am setup the gap is a .031
However, with a 3 Ohm coil, proper leads and resistor spark plugs I`d go for .035 - .043.
Does this all make a difference ?
Absolutely. I saw it myself when working in a shop with a Sunnen diagnostic "wall" loaded with oscilloscopes.
Do I change something ?
I will change the HT leads from copper to tin plated copper wires.
The insulation at one wire is cut but THE reason for changing them
now is that one lead is 4" too long and spare boots for the plugs have become outragiously expensive here.
So it`s new tin plated HT leads for me. That`s it but I guess I will forget all about it and keep on snarling at the wire with my butt on the seat
Would I go for pointer iggie again ?
I installed new bushings in the timer last year and I`m quite happy about the runout
Now all I need is a pointer which is straight and I don`t have to laugh at hysterically once unpacked
Then I would give it a shot.
But I`m notoriously lazy and this V-tronic is soooo sweet ...
BTW: With the Shovel I have had hardly problems reg the ignition. Provided the base-plate fits snug into the cone everything is easy. I was messing a lil with electronic ignitions when Blue Streak was experiencing IMHO a serious QC problem
ray
I was busting knuckles on this bike almost every day for 18mths to get her somewhat running and I simply wanted to gooooo !
5 days before I left for my 2500mls shakedown ride I was messing with the trans on the bench for the 3rd time
So I didn`t care about getting the right coil, HT wires, plugs.
I knew that it will work for sure.
But I also knew then, that I won`t get the best performance reg fuel-milage, idle-control, etc.
But this is exactly the reason why I am happy with this iggie because I haven`t got anything to complain.
No fouled plugs, no kick backs, no pinging but we all know that a non leaking manifold is the crux
Yea, she is a gaz guzzling pig when loaded with a tent on the handlebar, sidebags, clothes and tools
and you need a sensible twist of the wrist to enjoy more than 33mpg.
Would I get a higher mileage with a proper setup ?
For sure !
It will be minor but that difference might save you from pushing 600lbs plus to the next gas station
Even with a gap too wide between module and rotor she works sweet (I didn`t want to file, drill at the base plate)
I was actually surprised about how well it works with a spark so timid
IMHO, a 2 or 3 Ohm coil with graphite HT leads combined with resistor plugs would be a wise choice for an electronic ignition.
It`s more a personal thing that I don`t like Dyna ignitions and that I don`t like graphite leads and I`m tired of Andrews coils which kept
on crapping out on me after less than 10.000 mls.
Naturally, always a 3 days ride from home in 100F and rush hour grrrr. I`m done with Andrews.
Regarding plugs:
Really, I don`t care who`s the manufacturer.
With the Shovel I never ever felt a difference wether it is Champion, Bosch, Beru or NGK. No Delco available here
It`s just the 14mm short thread and the proper heat range I`m looking for.
With the Pan and the am setup the gap is a .031
However, with a 3 Ohm coil, proper leads and resistor spark plugs I`d go for .035 - .043.
Does this all make a difference ?
Absolutely. I saw it myself when working in a shop with a Sunnen diagnostic "wall" loaded with oscilloscopes.
Do I change something ?
I will change the HT leads from copper to tin plated copper wires.
The insulation at one wire is cut but THE reason for changing them
now is that one lead is 4" too long and spare boots for the plugs have become outragiously expensive here.
So it`s new tin plated HT leads for me. That`s it but I guess I will forget all about it and keep on snarling at the wire with my butt on the seat
Would I go for pointer iggie again ?
I installed new bushings in the timer last year and I`m quite happy about the runout
Now all I need is a pointer which is straight and I don`t have to laugh at hysterically once unpacked
Then I would give it a shot.
But I`m notoriously lazy and this V-tronic is soooo sweet ...
BTW: With the Shovel I have had hardly problems reg the ignition. Provided the base-plate fits snug into the cone everything is easy. I was messing a lil with electronic ignitions when Blue Streak was experiencing IMHO a serious QC problem
ray
- Attachments
-
- Vtronic_21.jpg (85.07 KiB) Viewed 673 times
-
- Member
- Posts: 217
- Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:07 pm
- Bikes: Panhead FL 1960
- Has thanked: 22 times
- Been thanked: 20 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
I bought the orange, which has automatic advance. Mainly because of my column problems I couldn't be kicking so many times and maybe this would make it easier.
I am currently having problems with the carburetor (excess gasoline) and have not really managed to test it. I only had a doubt when installing it, maybe silly, but I did not know or find information about the order in which the two pieces are inserted into the rotor. Also due to the carburetor problems, I have left it at number 0, which is supposed to be to adjust the carburetor and I did the test of moving to another mode (1) and it turned off or red knob return to 0, I dont know I thats normal, so I have not yet been able to draw a conclusion but I want to believe that will be a good improvement.
I am currently having problems with the carburetor (excess gasoline) and have not really managed to test it. I only had a doubt when installing it, maybe silly, but I did not know or find information about the order in which the two pieces are inserted into the rotor. Also due to the carburetor problems, I have left it at number 0, which is supposed to be to adjust the carburetor and I did the test of moving to another mode (1) and it turned off or red knob return to 0, I dont know I thats normal, so I have not yet been able to draw a conclusion but I want to believe that will be a good improvement.
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 890
- Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:01 pm
- Bikes: '61 Pan
'83 FXWG
'74 T150
'41 Indian, '29Norton
'25 HD
'13 JAP
'12 BSA,
'11&'12 NH
'08 Triumph - Location: NZ
- Has thanked: 509 times
- Been thanked: 366 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
Ray, thanks for the good summary. I appreciate the sharing of information, it helps a lot.
33mpg, ouch!! I know what that's like. When I ran Linkert it's exactly the number I got. We pay the same amount for gas$7/US gal. FYI, I'm averaging 48mpg with my SU carb. Hopefully you can fine-tune an improvement.
Keen to know what you saw on the oscilliscope.
33mpg, ouch!! I know what that's like. When I ran Linkert it's exactly the number I got. We pay the same amount for gas$7/US gal. FYI, I'm averaging 48mpg with my SU carb. Hopefully you can fine-tune an improvement.
That's interesting. I'm of the opposite persuasion. I like copper leads and non suppressor plugs, as I've set up all my analog iggies for 40+ years. Digital iggies are my exception. Currently the Pan has run the Dyna S for just over a year with no suppressors anywhere.IMHO, a 2 or 3 Ohm coil with graphite HT leads combined with resistor plugs would be a wise choice for an electronic ignition.
Everyone's got their favorite and they like what they've had good luck with. While one person will swear by a particular brand, another will swear at them. It's normal human behavior. For me NOS Champion. Brand new is somewhat hard to find. Otherwise I used NGK.Regarding plugs:
.030" here. I think, the wider the gap, the harder the ignitor chip works. Same with adding graphite resistor leads. I see the plug gap as the ultimate resistance.With the Pan and the am setup the gap is a .031
However, with a 3 Ohm coil, proper leads and resistor spark plugs I`d go for .035 - .043.
Does this all make a difference ?
Absolutely. I saw it myself when working in a shop with a Sunnen diagnostic "wall" loaded with oscilloscopes.
Keen to know what you saw on the oscilliscope.
Can't see them putting the same amount of effort into the parts when market is drying up.Blue Streak was experiencing IMHO a serious QC problem
-
- Member
- Posts: 217
- Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:07 pm
- Bikes: Panhead FL 1960
- Has thanked: 22 times
- Been thanked: 20 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
I have a problem with my v-tronic. It's hard for me to turn it on, it's on time. Once on, if I move to any of the maps (1-9) it stalls and turns off if I don't keep it speeding up, it only works on map 0, what could it be?
-
- Member
- Posts: 475
- Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:09 am
- Bikes: 1951 FL
- Location: Germany
- Has thanked: 85 times
- Been thanked: 231 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
I`m lost
This is the Samwel V-Tronic.
For some time the blue module is now orange
There are no dip switches or maps to select
This is the Samwel V-Tronic.
For some time the blue module is now orange
There are no dip switches or maps to select
- Attachments
-
- vtronic.jpg (58.98 KiB) Viewed 305 times
-
- Site Admin
- Senior Member
- Posts: 3291
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2001 12:00 pm
- Bikes: 1954 FL
- Location: Holland
- Has thanked: 108 times
- Been thanked: 488 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
Pictures may help.Once on, if I move to any of the maps (1-9) it stalls and turns off if I don't keep it speeding up, it only works on map 0, what could it be?
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 890
- Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:01 pm
- Bikes: '61 Pan
'83 FXWG
'74 T150
'41 Indian, '29Norton
'25 HD
'13 JAP
'12 BSA,
'11&'12 NH
'08 Triumph - Location: NZ
- Has thanked: 509 times
- Been thanked: 366 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
It appears DaCs has the eauto-advance model
Quote from documentation: 9 different advance curve settings, each one corresponding to the positions 1-9
of the module switch. Curve #1 is the most, curve
#9 the least aggressive one. Setting 0 will only be
used for carburetor adjustments as it fixes the timing to full advance at all rpm.
Quote from documentation: 9 different advance curve settings, each one corresponding to the positions 1-9
of the module switch. Curve #1 is the most, curve
#9 the least aggressive one. Setting 0 will only be
used for carburetor adjustments as it fixes the timing to full advance at all rpm.
-
- Member
- Posts: 475
- Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:09 am
- Bikes: 1951 FL
- Location: Germany
- Has thanked: 85 times
- Been thanked: 231 times
Re: Samwel v-tronic
Never seen this unit before.
To be honest I re-read the instruction Ex posted 3x and didn`t understand. Without having the parts at hand mind you
Here you find another instructions of this unit.
Its in 5 languages and with this one I understood what`s this iggie all about
https://www.wwag.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects ... e=%2179654
First, I guess the rotor (which is a 2-part split piece) isn`t set between 10-20 degrees or the rotor is too close or too far away from the module.
Second personally I don`t believe it is a good idea to change the setting from 1-9 while it is running. To me it makes perfect sense that the engine is cutting out once you turn the dial
The above mentioned instructions do elaborate a lil more on troubleshooting
To be honest I re-read the instruction Ex posted 3x and didn`t understand. Without having the parts at hand mind you
Here you find another instructions of this unit.
Its in 5 languages and with this one I understood what`s this iggie all about
https://www.wwag.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects ... e=%2179654
First, I guess the rotor (which is a 2-part split piece) isn`t set between 10-20 degrees or the rotor is too close or too far away from the module.
Second personally I don`t believe it is a good idea to change the setting from 1-9 while it is running. To me it makes perfect sense that the engine is cutting out once you turn the dial
The above mentioned instructions do elaborate a lil more on troubleshooting