Why did this 58 FL get parked?

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RUBONE
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#196

Post by RUBONE »

The crash bars, and some filters...the filter was part of the chrome finish group, or could be had over the counter as well.
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bangkokbob
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#197

Post by bangkokbob »

These days they have a paper drop in filters.
I've opened a few up over the years and never found anything in them to warrant using one.
Only some dark discoloration on inside pleating.
I only change filter every 2nd oil change.
I do run Amsoil 60wt synthetic all year round also which may help.
Regards B.B.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#198

Post by PanPal »

I don't feel the OEM filter is efficient enough to invest in. If this was a full new paint shinny chrome restoration project I might invest in the bling. I do run a evo filter on my custom pan chop and I think they do help. Regular oil changes will do fine on this bike and those OE filters can be a PITA and many times don't even get serviced because people don't want to deal with getting them sealed up again after servicing. I am still interested in those crash bars if we could work something out Robbie, I just don't have any of the items of interest to trade.
The exhaust is being worked on now. As it always ends up I need to add a little pipe extension to the front header and perhaps the front of the Y pipe. Then take a little off the rear header and work out spacers and muffler clamp alignments. I was able to separate all the pipe connections on the old exhaust and remove the Y pipe from the newer muffler using acetylene oxygen torch at work. It looks like a OE Y pipe so I may use this instead of the shinny new aftermarket one installed in the pictures. The throttle grip came off easily. It was Kroil soaked for about a year and didn't take all that much to unscrew this time. It felt like I was going to push the whole bike off the table last time I attempted it so it sat. The inner wire and spool were pulled out. I sprayed carb cleaner into the hole in the handlebar side and cleaned the gum off the inside of the outer cable. Cleaned up the inner cable greased it and put it back in then greased the carburetor end several times and worked more grease in from this side. It works much better, however I'm going to buy 2 coils of wire from McMaster Carr to try. My inner wires on both throttle and timer measure .053. For just over $6.00 I can get one roll of .049 and one roll of .045 spring wire. I will use it elsewhere if it doesn't move effortlessly with one of these. They are both pretty good but could be a bit better. Many years ago I purchased a throttle cable for a lawn mower from tractor supply and pulled the inner wire out which was a PVC coated wire. I put that on my 59 timer and it was super smooth to operate. I think I need a new bale wire wavy clip for this timer. One of the bent tabs is snapped off and is causing a bit of drag advancing and retarding the timer. Does anyone sell a good wavy replacement C clip?. Last night I re shimmed and cotter pinned the swivel that secures the inner throttle cable to the throttle lever. It fully opens and closes the throttle disc now that it is shimmed. It had a spring on top of the throttle lever and the swivel moved around to much to fully open the throttle disc before shimming. Worked on the 2 pushrod tubes that were tight to collapse. one is done and one needs a little more massaging.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#199

Post by hplhd »

panpal, did you find the header covers? p/m me you email addy. I have some in a box somewhere and I can email you pics as soon as I have time(this weekend) to locate them. Rich
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#200

Post by nmaineron »

Don't just love playing with all those little things that make things go so much better when given a little love and so much worse when they are neglected... I always thought that the throttle and timer wire was something different than mild steel general purpose wire, almost spring steel like. I also found that the outer cable cover makes life alot easier if it is good and rigid. Some of the aftermarket cables are thinner and flexible and don't work well at all. Much easier to snake through the handle bars but that about it.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#201

Post by panhead_kicker »

PanPal wrote: Wed Nov 07, 2018 6:40 pm ...My inner wires on both throttle and timer measure .053. For just over $6.00 I can get one roll of .049 and one roll of .045 spring wire. ...
Hey PanPal, here is my experience using smaller gauge wire:
Throttle control wire 56377-65 replacement.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#202

Post by PanPal »

Unfortunately my good friend is in a constant vegetative state and now has been moved to long term care. Every complete motor rebuild I’ve done car or big twin motorcycle since 1981 I’ve done at his place and almost all these correct parts I need have come from his shop shelves. I really miss being able to talk over things with him and I hope his son and father can figure out how to deal with his personal empire of Vintage Harley Bike, tool, and parts and his civil war collections. It’s been busy this Holiday season but I have accomplished a few things. I cut and crimped the new speedometer inner cable and installed it. No progress on the generator wire assembly that I want to do sooner than later. I am not sure what the route is for these wires from the generator back to the regulator mounted outside the coil? I’ve had the exhaust system on and off a dozen or more times and played with different pipes and pieces and have now settled on what is pictured below. Worked out a deal with hplhd on some slinky covers and a Duo rear header pipe that positions the Y pipe connection away from the kicker spring better. The oil lines are not touching the pipe or oil tank and the OE, Y pipe and one of the mufflers that were on this bike look good in my mind anyway. I weld the slots in both header pipes where they attach to the head ports. The slots seem too wide and long and seem to leak and blow carbon on the heads, so I always weld the slots closed, then use a hack saw and put 3 new slots in the depth of the hack saw blade. They fit nice and snug on the head ports. I added a ½ inch long piece of pipe to the front header and about 2 inches of pipe to the back of the Y pipe. Now clamps line up and all the pipes are fully inserted into flares when it’s assembled. I need to cut off the extra leg with the mounting hole and tweak the muffler body clamp a little and everything is ready to high temp RTV then secure in place. The gas strainer is cleaned, has new gaskets and is installed. The pushrod tubes have new rubberized cork seals and are installed with pushrods adjusted. I adjust them a bit differently than the manual. I fully compress the hydraulic units then back the adjustment off 1 and ¾ turns. Then I test compression distance on each pushrod with dry hydraulics, fill them with oil and pump them up and install the covers. I left off the front intake tube clip until I get the timing set, but they are in place now. I installed the .049 inner wire on the throttle cable. It comes in a roll, so I needed to straighten the wire before inserting it, but the throttle is nice and smooth now and fully opens the throttle and I have some adjustment left to lower the idle if needed. The inner primary has been cleaned up a little and a few dents here and there were hammered out. It is now bolted on the motor end and the lower rear mount has the correct bolt with cotter pin hole, spring, washer, and nut installed. I need to make one for the upper rear mount since the oil tank that was on this bike didn’t have the tab or bolt installed. I looked everywhere for the outer primary cover screws I removed then later realized it had some button head flat blade screws installed when I removed it. I’ve purchased the proper cad plated fillister head Phillips screws that should be here by Monday. I pulled out the clutch assembly and have a bunch going on trying to get this ready to install. There are 5 friction discs and 4 steel plates with all the anti rattle balls still intact. I purchased a half spring plate that should also come Monday and I will take out one of the friction discs and use this. I did not have the woodruff key for my clutch hub, so I pulled out my woodruff key assortment. The key does not seem to properly seat. Are these special keys? I think it sits a little proud and may not allow the hub so seat on the taper. It also does not fill the entire curved cutout in the shaft. I plan to fit this better and do some checking before the hub gets installed. The hub isn’t ready yet either. The studs need more polishing. I worked out most of the grooves from clutch plates and some of the pitting. But there is more work to be done before it goes in service. The bearing surfaces ( Hub and Clutch basket) look good and the friction disc on the hub is in nice shape and riveted well to the hub. I degreased the clutch plates several times and now have them scuffed up and ready to put on. I will however chamfer all the stud holes before putting them in. The steels looked pretty glazed with uneven contact on some areas. Also two steels have a different ID. I’m guessing the larger ID steels are replacements. I chucked up all the steels in the lathe and resurfaced them. None of the steels appear warped. Will put a drop of oil on each rattler ball and they are good to go. A bit of grinding on the holes on the fork tins and the gap between front and rear tin is getting better. They still need a little work, but they are getting there. The piles on the parts bench is getting a lot smaller, I have wire wheeled and separated all the CP bolts and try to see where each bolt can be installed. I’d really like to get correct hardware for the rear fender struts. 58 was a one year only oval head screw flat blade I believe. But with the saddle bag bracket, four screws get changed to bolts, so the mounting hardware sets offered won’t do me much good. Apparently I suck at e bay. I usually bid to early and get outbid at the last minute. So There was a really cool aluminum replacement front fender tip for sale. This was the last big cosmetic piece I wanted for this bike. I watched and waited until the end of the auction. Pushed the bid now button on my phone screen and some old max bid number was in the bid box. Typed in my max bid, but had too many numbers, back spaced the numbers and put my bid in and the auction ended before it took my bid. Unbelievable, my max bid was almost twice what the thing sold for.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#203

Post by Andygears »

Your build is looking great! Get the right key for the clutch hub, if it's too long there might not be room for the lock ear to seat flat. My inner ear crushed when I tightened the nut, a year? later the nut backed off and left me spinning the hub.

Great job

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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#204

Post by RUBONE »

The key length looks OK, but the height is wrong. H-D keys are specific to location. Far right is a clutch hub key.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#205

Post by PanPal »

Thanks for the guidance on the key. Ill look for the correct part.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#206

Post by PanPal »

I have the exhaust installed with header clamps, the frame to front header clamps secured the squish bolted to the frame tab and the muffler to Y pipe clamp secured to the muffler bracket, all RTVed together. I still need to install the rear body clamp on the muffler to wrap this up. I was trying to line up this rear clamp hole with the hole in the muffler support bracket and at one point I tried to pry down on the top of the muffler with a wooden handle between the bottom of the swing arm and top of the muffler. I quickly found that wasn’t going to work because it just compresses the rear shock instead of having something solid to pry against, But I did see that I need to replace the shock bushings. The back of the swing arm moves up and down about 3/8” due to worn out bushings. I see plenty of bushings for sale on e bay, so I’ll have to order a set and install them. I reinstalled the right footboard and rear brake master cylinder but need to get nuts on the rear footboard brackets. Ordered the correct clutch hub key and it worked out much better than a standard woodruff key. I finished polishing up the studs on the hub. The hub went on and seated fully on the taper. It is tightened down and the tab is bent over to secure the hub nut. I greased up the rollers and installed the clutch basket. The half plate came in for the clutch. The steel plate on the back was flat and I recall the finger being lifted from the rest of the plate on the OEM half plate I’ve had in the past. I sprung each finger a bit and sanded the raised tips of the fingers flat. When I was ready to put this plate on the holes did not line up with the studs on my clutch hub. Wrong part and I don’t know what this plate fits. These plates help feather clutch release and I will try to find a real one but for now 5 friction plates and 4 steel plates are installed. I installed the primary chain and front sprocket and adjusted the primary chain but I can’t get to the transmission bolts to set final chain tension until I take the bike off the table. I also need this off to install and tighten the rear footboard brackets. So before I take this off the table I need to finish up a couple things. Front wheel would spin half a rotation free and drag a bit for half a rotation. The brake adjuster on the top of the brake tube was extended pretty far and I wanted to take some slack out of the front cable. I removed the front wheel backed off the cable adjuster and pulled another half” of slack out. I set the wheel up in the truing stand with the front drum installed and indicated the inside surface of the drum in all five positions to see which position the drum ran the truest. I read anything from .013 to .006. In the .006 location I put a small paint marker dot in line with the grease fitting on the hub so I knew where to position it when the wheel went on. It is back on and I am working on getting the front brake adjusted by going back and forth adjusting the cable, squeezing the brake, loosening the nut holding the backing plate to the fork. Turning the slotted end of the stud and tightening the nut. It now seems to be dragging evenly if I over tighten the cable, but the brake lever seems to pull further in than I am use to when applying full brake pressure with it adjusted to no drag spinning the wheel. This I think is because of the pulling the cable slack out. I need to make sure the cable from the brake tube to the link inside the brake are relaxed in a straight line from cable connection to the brake lever for the pads. After a few good uses, I can probably just readjust the cable when things seat in better. The rear wheel is also off the go through the brake hub truing process so I can get the rear brake pad adjuster set properly. Since I had the primary chain tension close to where it needs to be set, I was able to cut my rear drive chain to length. I used some scotch brite on the outer primary heavily rusted areas and have this ready to put on once the clutch and primary chain adjusting is completed. There were a few good dings in the outer primary. I have this 8” by 8” sand filled cloth bag I acquired somewhere. I had this set on my stack of wood pellets for the stove. I set the outer primary on this bags and with a wooden dowel and a hammer worked out all the dents really well.
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#207

Post by RooDog »

I see that you have more plates and fiber discs stacked in your clutch than were called for originally with either a Mouse Trap or foot clutch which leads to less separation between each plate when disengaging the clutch, so you may not have enough travel to use that last outer half/buffer plate. I am not using that fingered plate in my 1950 Panny, with Mouse Trap, and with no harm what so ever in clutch action. Eliminator style clutches do not use that spring plate either, so it may not be necessary. You will know better after you have a coulpa hundred miles on that scooter giving every thing time to seat in. At that time the clutch will most likely need a little attention.
RooDog
PS: I too have a smaller diameter spring plate with a smaller stud circle, perhaps for a 45 Flatty? Anybody got an OD for such a spring plate?
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#208

Post by PanPal »

RooDog you bring up a good point. I installed what came out. The question is why it was put together this way. I know the discs are aftermarket and may be a bit thinner than original discs. The raised lip on the pressure plate is flush with the outer edge of the clutch basket with the plates and discs I have installed now. It looks like there is over ¼” of the keys showing above the top steel plate in the basket and plenty of room for the pressure plate to push outwards and not catch on the shoulder on the threaded studs. My parts book covers a wide range of years , and the picture shows five discs and 4 steels, but the discs are a 68 part # and the steels are a 41 part number and says 3 or 4. So what is the proper clutch pack stacked height? I don’t have the spring height adjusted in the previous post picture. I also have a 50 pan running a mousetrap without the half plate, but its a lighter chopped custom bike and I really liked the clutch feel on my 59 with the half spring plate installed. I now have both wheels back on and spinning free with little to no drag and a front brake that has decent lever feel. The rear brake adjusters are adjusted and I’m trying to bleed the brakes and master cylinder, I’ve had good success with a oil gun pumping fluid from the wheel cylinder bleed screw back through the master cylinder until bubbles stop coming out inside the master cylinder. It appears my oil gun designated to do this has swelled something in the check valve assembly because bubbles go towards the bleed screw than come back into the oil gun when the lever is released. I may try to use a syringe tonight or have to order a new oil gun to get this bled. I have the gap closed on the right side front to back fork tin, but my lower tree threads are stripped And I need to helicoil this. This may require removing the fork tubes from the tree being a through hole unless I have or can make a helicoil bottom tap. I removed the stud nuts holding the rear shock on and peeled the washers off the rubber bushings. Yep…Bushings have given all they can and need replacement. I’ve been purchasing CP and correct hardware kits off e bay the last week or so. Bought a set correct for mounting the saddlebag bracket luggage rack to the fender and purchased cad plated spacers. I also bought a gas tank mount bolt stud and nut set. The cad plated outer primary cover screws. I need the strut to rear flip up fender screws, but the only one I found comes as a kit with 6 correct for 58 only slotted oval head screws and CP bolts for the strut to frame bolts. I really only need 2 screws since this has a luggage rack. Anyone know of a vendor selling these individual bolts and screws rather than kits?
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#209

Post by easykick »

If you are needing hardware (bolts,nuts ) try OLD DUDE .com or call 877-653-3833. They will have what you need.if you have H-D part number you can look it up on their web site.
Good Luck
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Re: Why did this 58 FL get parked?

#210

Post by Scrap »

Mytyvac MV 8000 brake bleeder, $38.00 on Amazon. If you feel like spending the money, it works. Always look forward to your progress posts. Can't wait to see it running again.
Sam
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