New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

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DeltaElite
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#16

Post by DeltaElite »

To me it looks more like the bulb holder is made like a can with a hole in the bottom. The part with the arrow is solidly attached. Insulator seems to be somehow attached from behind. I'm afraid of getting the insulator and spring out but will never be able to get it in again.
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#17

Post by RooDog »

DeltaElite wrote: Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:45 pm To me it looks more like the bulb holder is made like a can with a hole in the bottom. The part with the arrow is solidly attached. Insulator seems to be somehow attached from behind. I'm afraid of getting the insulator and spring out but will never be able to get it in again.
So, what have you got to lose? It's currently not working anyway. Put on your big boy pants and dive into it.
Robbie told you right. Push the insulator down against the spring, tilt it until the guide ears may be disengaged from their slots and it should pull out. I recently redid some of my own lamps, it's a bit tricky but doable. Also new internals, springs, insulators, and terminated wires are all available on eBay. It's all part of the fun of owning and working on these old Harleys....
....RooDog....
DeltaElite
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#18

Post by DeltaElite »

RooDog wrote: Wed Sep 21, 2022 2:15 pm
So, what have you got to lose?
A working pair of OEM Lights for 400€🤣
It's currently not working anyway. Put on your big boy pants and dive into it.
Wilco!
Push the insulator down against the spring, tilt it until the guide ears may be disengaged from their slots and it should pull out.
I think Problem is putting it in again. I still can't imagine what it looks like behind the socket. Picture anywhere?
Also new internals, springs, insulators, and terminated wires are all available on eBay.
You have a link?
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#19

Post by RooDog »

Seek and ye shall find. There are many suppliers, the trick is finding one who will ship to Germany.
PS: Start by soaking in penetrating oil...
You could also make one of these fit....
https://www.ebay.com/itm/142236802774?h ... R9TLqozsYA
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#20

Post by DeltaElite »

Just checked it with a dentist-mirror.

No ears or whatever visible. Just a closed "open can-style" container on the backside of the socket. The insulator is inserted from the back. Between backside of socket and lamp-housing its no more than 5mm space.

I think it's likely impossible to get the insulator-assembly out of there. And I don't think there is any chance to put it back when you have to slide it in together with a spring and then turn it.

Regarding turning: there's no way to turn anything in the insulator-assembly. No movement at all except that you can push it against the spring but no turning to either side.

My socket also looks totally different than those in the ebay link.

I guess I leave it like it is and solder a pin connector to the one end.
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#21

Post by nifty »

According to 41-54 parts manual, internal parts not serviced for early single-contact signal/direction lamps
I'd be surprised if AM restoration parts aren't made, you can't be the only person in the world with old petrified wire.

However 41-54 parts manual shows other bulb holder/socket parts, some may fit, or be adaptable, or at least give you an idea of what might be inside your single contact lamp. I see no tabs/ears on single wire insulators. None have insulator inserted from back.

The ebay link type single wire bulb holder will work, as is, but requires gutting of your lamp, and mounting. (If you can get wires through stud, you could convert all your lamps to 2-wire offset pin bulb holders and run as Roodog suggested, use brake&tail-light 6v double filament/double contact bulbs with brake filament for turn signal)
Germany has a robust restoration industry with specialist suppliers, ditto other European countries (motorcycles, cars, aircraft).
You may be able to harvest useable parts from a non H-D bulb holder
Early Mack trucks (B models in particular) used a lot of Guide lamps, there is a good supply of OE NOS & AM restoration parts for Mack
Many cars will yield similar, non Guide, but adaptable bulb holders.
Modern small bulbs, or LEDs are tiny but put out more light, easier to adapt.
If desperate you could solder wires direct to bulb (or LED), insulate & mount with a big blob of Sikaflex or silicone.
Or do nothing, maybe get a traffic ticket, or be run-over, when petrified wiring fails again.

Nifty
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-49 fender lamp guts pg158 41-54 parts.jpg
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Last edited by nifty on Sat Sep 24, 2022 9:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#22

Post by RooDog »

Most any light socket I have dealt with in 50 years has loaded from the front, the light bulb side. The back needs to be partially closed to give the spring a seat. It's really quite simple....
....;RooDog....
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#23

Post by DeltaElite »

I gave it a sharp look again today. Seems that these specific turn-signal-lights are not serviceable (with normal effort)

In the following picture you can see the bracket that holds the socket cup with the slot (that holds the bulb). The bracket is "riveted" to the lamp housing as seen on pictures above.

If you take a close look into the socket-cup you can see that this is one piece. No way that anything could be pulled out there. In the bottom of the socket cup you can see spring loaded insulator with the 1-point contact for the bulb.
20220922_165345.jpg
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In this picture, if you concentrate on what you see in the mirror surface, you can see that the bracket holds 2 cups : one outer cup holding the bulb that is attached to the outside of the holding-bracket and one inner cup with smaller diameter underneath the bracket.
20220922_165534.jpg
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Here I managed to make an even better picture.
20220922_165716.jpg
20220922_165716.jpg (249.88 KiB) Viewed 477 times
Any ideas how these "cups" are connected?
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#24

Post by RooDog »

It looks to me that the inside of the socket is bound up with rust. Kill the rust and the insulator & wire should pull out toward you.
Last edited by RooDog on Sat Sep 24, 2022 2:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#25

Post by nifty »

Delta Elite
Looks like all single wire GUIDE bullets have same electrical guts, lens gasket, lenses, rims & screws 1930's to 1960's
Not entirely sure what this link ad is selling, maybe a repair kit for 2 x 68553-58? but he shows the electrical guts, gaskets & screws
Electrical guts looks to me like an easy make it yourself, or repair what you have, or pay & wait.
Googled "parts for GUIDE DH-49", and there it was, fancy that!

Nifty
https://www.2040-parts.com/harley-panhe ... -i1048935/
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DeltaElite
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#26

Post by DeltaElite »

Nifty, thanks for the Link. Yeah, it really looks easy from the electrical internals.

Does anybody know what the round Gaskets with the small hole in the middle are for?

Unfortunately if one tries to order it says "This offer is not up to date, it is impossible to place order." :roll:

Does anybody know who in Reno (or elsewhere) could be the one to produce this stuff?
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#27

Post by nifty »

You don't think perhaps the gasket with central hole might be for stud/base????
https://www.2040-parts.com/contact/
Ask?
or
fs-5219 Chev.jpg
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GUIDE is a trademark of General Motors Lighting Division, fair chance that GMC-Chevrolet used GUIDE components.
Measure OD of your insulators, send them an email re their dimensions.
They have others, several of which look like other H-D lighting parts.
https://store.fillingstation.com/dept/E ... ckets.html

Or send me your lamps and pay for my time, and I'll replace wires and make them work.


Nifty
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#28

Post by Andygears »

DeltaElite wrote: Sun Sep 25, 2022 4:22 pm Nifty, thanks for the Link. Yeah, it really looks easy from the electrical internals.

Does anybody know what the round Gaskets with the small hole in the middle are for?

Unfortunately if one tries to order it says "This offer is not up to date, it is impossible to place order." :roll:

Does anybody know who in Reno (or elsewhere) could be the one to produce this stuff?
Get some gasket material, and sharpen the end of some appropriately sized tubing and make those gaskets!

You cannot “buy” every single part to restore these old bikes. Some stuff has to be created out of ingenuity.

Andygears
RooDog
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#29

Post by RooDog »

Andygears wrote: Mon Sep 26, 2022 3:20 pm
DeltaElite wrote: Sun Sep 25, 2022 4:22 pm Nifty, thanks for the Link. Yeah, it really looks easy from the electrical internals.

Does anybody know what the round Gaskets with the small hole in the middle are for?

Unfortunately if one tries to order it says "This offer is not up to date, it is impossible to place order." :roll:

Does anybody know who in Reno (or elsewhere) could be the one to produce this stuff?
Get some gasket material, and sharpen the end of some appropriately sized tubing and make those gaskets!

You cannot “buy” every single part to restore these old bikes. Some stuff has to be created out of ingenuity.

Andygears
Mechanical understanding and abilities, and imagination are necessary if one wants to play in the vintage Harley sandbox....
Last edited by RooDog on Tue Sep 27, 2022 12:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
DeltaElite
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Re: New wiring for turn-indicator on socket?

#30

Post by DeltaElite »

Well, maybe that's also a question of availability and not so much a question of imagination and abilities.

If you have an extremely expensive OEM-Part that's made out of Unobtainium and that's perfectly working and you just want to have that original clothed-wire on it, just to make it as original as possible, you might hesitate to shred it apart if you have no insight on how it's looking inside.

Language-Barrier is the next thing. If you don't know how all the parts are named its hard to make a proper search.

But with the help of @nifty and the link he provided, I identified that the part I would need is called "pig-tail". I found a close up picture of the Guider Pigtails and then it came to me:

You just have to clip of that super-sturdy wire and then simply pull the button out of the socket. The button will come out together with the wire, the spring and the pertinax-plate.

So, problem solved. Does anybody know a source for the button to be soldered to the end of the wire? I can't find anything for "button". Maybe there's another term for it?
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