1949 oil feed
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woodie
1949 oil feed
After doing a valve job on my 49 pan I had oil almost pouring out off the bottom of the front barrel. When I tore it back apart I noticed two holes in the case. One hole lines up with the oil feed hole in the cylinder, and the other one seems to be at an angle and have something soft in it like rtv. A friend says there should be a soft plug in this hole but not sure. Whats the deal?
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fourthgear
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Re: 1949 oil feed
woodie
Sounds like your oil return from your cylinder was blocked from some one using too much RTV. You would be surprized how many people think that more of that shit is better. You might want to do a total disassembly for safty sake , I know you don't want to here that ! That stuff could be in your oil pump and every thing else that the oil in your motor touched.Good luck .
Sounds like your oil return from your cylinder was blocked from some one using too much RTV. You would be surprized how many people think that more of that shit is better. You might want to do a total disassembly for safty sake , I know you don't want to here that ! That stuff could be in your oil pump and every thing else that the oil in your motor touched.Good luck .
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Jack_Hester
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Re: 1949 oil feed
I'm inclined to agree with 4thgear. But, then, I don't mind tearing an engine down. I do not like RTV, or any other silicon based sealer. I don't know the mileage on your engine, but there's no telling what has been going on inside. Tell your friend that there is no such thing as a 'soft plug' in any oil passage.
Jack
Jack
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woodie
Re: 1949 oil feed
There are two holes here. One that is the oil supply and lines up with the passage in the barrel that goes up to the rocker arms. This other oil that I'm ? is about 3/16" away from the oil feed toward the tappet blocks. It appears to be drilled at an angle. No other rtv has been used on any of the gaskets. The gasket I used that leaked was steel and had an elongated hole that really didnt line up with either hole. The new gaskets, which are James gaskets, only line up with the oil supply hole. I think that this hole is for accessing a passage or something and only goes into the crankcass. When it was leaking so bad I had a bolt in the chain oiler to keep it from leaking and have been told that the oiler is the vent for the crankcase and probably that is why oil was pouring out. But I would like to be a little more sure before I button it all up. Does this make sense to anybody?
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mbskeam
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Re: 1949 oil feed
hello,
I think the passage that is angled is for the feed to the top end(the oil ports to the heads).the oil ports from the top tie into this angled port. I think it then goes on down to the oil pump from there.
Did the new gaskets that you put in have holes for the return side of the oil flow, and did your jugs have a hole in the left side about 1" up from bott. (56 and latter)if you do not have this hole are there holes in the gasket.
is your oil returning to your oil tank?
I think the glob of silicone you dug out on the outside on your cross feed port was put there by somebody thinking that they where fixin a leak, because I found the same thing on mine. it turned out to be a leaking (loose tapet guide screw) lifter guide gasket.
If you are having trouble getting the gaskets to line up you can use shovelhead and put the holes in the spot that best line up with your ports. my 49 case half has this very same issue, that the gaskets do not line up that well with the feed port and have very little outside meat on the case to support the bottom of the gasket.
mbskeam
I think the passage that is angled is for the feed to the top end(the oil ports to the heads).the oil ports from the top tie into this angled port. I think it then goes on down to the oil pump from there.
Did the new gaskets that you put in have holes for the return side of the oil flow, and did your jugs have a hole in the left side about 1" up from bott. (56 and latter)if you do not have this hole are there holes in the gasket.
is your oil returning to your oil tank?
I think the glob of silicone you dug out on the outside on your cross feed port was put there by somebody thinking that they where fixin a leak, because I found the same thing on mine. it turned out to be a leaking (loose tapet guide screw) lifter guide gasket.
If you are having trouble getting the gaskets to line up you can use shovelhead and put the holes in the spot that best line up with your ports. my 49 case half has this very same issue, that the gaskets do not line up that well with the feed port and have very little outside meat on the case to support the bottom of the gasket.
mbskeam
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Cotten
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Re: 1949 oil feed
Do your belly production numbers say -49?
My best guess is that the extra hole you refer to is where the gallery for feeding hydraulics is drilled from. But that wasn't until '53.
I have drilled a couple of early sets for feeding hydraulics, so perhaps yours was molested the same way. It should have little effect as long as you can keep it sanitary. I suggest tapping the gallery for a set screw to plug it at the cylinder deck. With some goober too, of course.
My best guess is that the extra hole you refer to is where the gallery for feeding hydraulics is drilled from. But that wasn't until '53.
I have drilled a couple of early sets for feeding hydraulics, so perhaps yours was molested the same way. It should have little effect as long as you can keep it sanitary. I suggest tapping the gallery for a set screw to plug it at the cylinder deck. With some goober too, of course.
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fourthgear
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Re: 1949 oil feed
Woody
I'm also agreeing with Cotton & Mbskeam, but we need a little more info . You said you had a bolt in the chain oiler ? Now do you do you have a later mod. punp with chain oiler valve or are you talking about the breather out of the Primary side of the motor ? if you had that pluged you will have all kinds of leaks sooner or later. If you do have a 49 case they were not set up for eather Hydrolic lifters or over head oiling. I also have 49 cases and some one in there infinet wisdom wanted to have Hyd. lifters in there , so they drilled from the oil feed passage for the tappets into the case , but drilled all the way thru into the crank case and put some kind of liquid weld in there of some thing . Well wouldn't ya know it , it worked its self out. When I bought the scoot it just pumped that black gold right out the breather hose. When I saw that I knew it had to come apart. I had a good welder down here weld it up right ( hard place to weld right there , I'm told )I got the Pan at such a good deal, I knew I would have to do a complete rebuild anyway .
If you intend to run Hyd. you might want to do the conversion and change the case oiling passages from the stock configuration. S & S has this on there web sight . There is another thread on this subject here somewhere . The stock is primary oil feed to lower end and secondary to the heads and the conversion swaps them around for Hyd. lifters , I believe thats how it goes .You also benifit from a longer engine life by changing it around , this may be for only later mod . oil pumps or S&S though . This sight is the best thing that ever happened to Panhead mechanics bar none.You will get alot more info here for sure . Sorry about the length .
I'm also agreeing with Cotton & Mbskeam, but we need a little more info . You said you had a bolt in the chain oiler ? Now do you do you have a later mod. punp with chain oiler valve or are you talking about the breather out of the Primary side of the motor ? if you had that pluged you will have all kinds of leaks sooner or later. If you do have a 49 case they were not set up for eather Hydrolic lifters or over head oiling. I also have 49 cases and some one in there infinet wisdom wanted to have Hyd. lifters in there , so they drilled from the oil feed passage for the tappets into the case , but drilled all the way thru into the crank case and put some kind of liquid weld in there of some thing . Well wouldn't ya know it , it worked its self out. When I bought the scoot it just pumped that black gold right out the breather hose. When I saw that I knew it had to come apart. I had a good welder down here weld it up right ( hard place to weld right there , I'm told )I got the Pan at such a good deal, I knew I would have to do a complete rebuild anyway .
If you intend to run Hyd. you might want to do the conversion and change the case oiling passages from the stock configuration. S & S has this on there web sight . There is another thread on this subject here somewhere . The stock is primary oil feed to lower end and secondary to the heads and the conversion swaps them around for Hyd. lifters , I believe thats how it goes .You also benifit from a longer engine life by changing it around , this may be for only later mod . oil pumps or S&S though . This sight is the best thing that ever happened to Panhead mechanics bar none.You will get alot more info here for sure . Sorry about the length .