Cylinders

Top End (cylinders pushrods etc.)
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Hauula Pan
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Cylinders

#1

Post by Hauula Pan »

I have a 1952 FL that is currently .060 over. On the last rebuild a few years ago I went with low compression pistons & Andrews #1 cam. I've not been happy with it since. Starting issues, the compression is too low, & it runs a bit too hot. So here's the question. To sleeve or replace the cylinders & return to stock pistons & cam. I have never been to fond of V-Twin's Taiwan junk & am extremely leery of purchasing their cylinders. So I actually have 2 questions. Has anyone had experience with sleeved cylinders & are there heat transfer issues with them? and Has anyone actually ran a set of V-Twin's cylinders and if so were there any issues with them? Please Don't turn this into an issue of V-Twin's quality, we all already know a good percentage of their stuff is sub-par but I'm interested to know if anyone has Actually purchased & ran their cylinders. & Info from people that have Actually installed & ran sleeved cylinders. In other words I'm seeking opinions based on Actual experience. Thanks.
socalrider
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Re: Cylinders

#2

Post by socalrider »

i have been running sleeved cylinders on my 65 for many years. have never had any issues with them carb, cam, stock, pistons 8:1. work done by l.a. sleeve. bike runs perfect and not abused.
arnulfo
Bosheff
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Re: Cylinders

#3

Post by Bosheff »

Runnin .060 over slugs could be a contributing factor to the hot condition yer experiencing. Mate that with slow ignition timing, or an air sucking condition and the problem is multiplied. Unless yer below 7 1/2 : 1 compression you should have all the compression you need to have a sweet runnin machine. I personally don't know what the #1 cam has for specs in relationship to a stock H-D FL or FLH cam, but the combo of low compression with a cam that has lots of lift/duration could give ya a motor that's lacking in the performance department, exhibits a soft throttle response, and possibly hard starting. There are other options for cylinders available. Try Axtell. Their products have always been aces in my book. Different folks have different opinions on sleeving cylinders, but if done correctly I can't see why there should be a problem. What comp ratio pistons are ya usin?....bosheff
Cotten
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Re: Cylinders

#4

Post by Cotten »

Haaula Pan!

.060" over is no where near the end of cylinder's life, if the machinist and mechanic know what they are doing, nor is it reason for over-heating by itself.

If you eventually choose to have cylinders sleeved, the machinist REALLY better know what he is doing. (Please use the search function for previous discussions on sleeving. (A sleeved cylinder has less matrix casting support than .100" over!)

Please be certain that the cause of heat is not other issues, such as Bosheff mentioned, plus over-advanced timing as well as retarded!

....Cotten
jdpan
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Re: Cylinders

#5

Post by jdpan »

Although I have no personal experience with them, I've read nothing but good things about LA-Sleeve's work and results. I have a set of oem cylinders I'm considering sending to them...
Mark
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Re: Cylinders

#6

Post by Mark »

I am running a set of OEM cylinders sleeved to stock....3 years no problem! Bills Custom Cycle.
rrhawg
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Re: Cylinders

#7

Post by rrhawg »

As stated above I believe that Axtell cylinders are the best. I have used the imported cylinders on a number of occasions though and had no problem with them. I do how ever bake them at 400 degrees before I fit the pistons as I was told by someone That this will cure them. I don't know if this is to bake out the hydrogen but that was my impression and like I said I've never had a problem with them.
I also believe as Cotten states that you can go bigger than .060 without any problems. I've seen bikes with .100 over pistons and I may still have a set on the shelf.

Rich
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Re: Cylinders

#8

Post by George Greer »

So,

If I may also ask....

My newly aquired 58 FL engines cylinder is setting at .070" over.......IF, the cylinders and pistons are OK, running them at the oversize is OK?

George
Cotten
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Re: Cylinders

#9

Post by Cotten »

George Greer wrote:So,

If I may also ask....

My newly aquired 58 FL engines cylinder is setting at .070" over.......IF, the cylinders and pistons are OK, running them at the oversize is OK?

George
George!

Only if they were fitted using stress fixtures known as "torque-plates", and you re-install at the same fastener torque.
torqplat.jpg
Beware many poorly-equipt shops will just give extra "idiot clearance" to avoid an immediate melt-down.

A bench inspection with a bore gauge in the spigots will give you clues: not only the clearance, but if they are round, and straight, even just above the base flange all around, then plates were not used.

With enormous bores at proper clearance using plates for fitting, the piston may even stick in the spigot with the plates removed!
I once had to re-apply a bottom plate to install the piston and rings to where the wristpin hole was exposed, remove the plate, and then slip the assembly over the rod end and install the pin "Indian-style". When the cylinder was then bopped down upon the studs with the palm of my hand, and the base nuts torqued, the pistons freed up perfectly, and the motor went into successful service.

Nearly all stories of large overbores running hot or fragging can be blamed upon fitting without stressing. The effect of the plates increases geometrically with larger and larger bores, first becoming significant at .060"-over. This is why the Factory did not supply pistons beyond that, but the Aftermarket does.

...Cotten
(PS: The effect of plates upon a sleeved cylinder starts at standard bore!)
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Hauula Pan
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Re: Cylinders

#10

Post by Hauula Pan »

Let me begin by saying THANKS for the informative replies. I feel much better about my cylinders being .060 over. However I'm confused about what the Stock compression ratio was on a 1952 FL, The Panhead manual lists it as 7:1 but the supposedly Low compression pistons that were installed supposedly to run better with today's gas are supposed to be 7.5:1 this is higher than the manual's 7:1 I also read elsewhere that Stock was 8:1 so can someone tell me what the STOCK compression ratio really is? To answer Bosheff's question I am currently running what I was told are Low Compression 7.5:1 flat top pistons, the Andrews #1 cam is supposed to be a match for the Low Compression pistons the timing is 16/36 Duration is 232 and Lift is .450 a compression check shows 60psi in both cylinders. (Also tweeked the timing & mixture a bit & runs cooler now) So can ya help me out with this compression ratio business? and is 60psi adequate? My dilemma now is stay with what I have or tear it down & go back to Stock??? (That is once someone tells me what Stock is supposed to be.) Thanks.
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