Hydraulic Lifters

Top End (cylinders pushrods etc.)
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otis
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Hydraulic Lifters

#1

Post by otis »

I have a '58 Pan that appears to be developing a failing front exhaust lifter. It would run great for about 20 or 30 minutes then it would lose power and run rough. When I roll on the throttle, the front head sounds like a glass jar with marbles rolling around inside. I've tried heavier oil and adjusted the pushrods several times with the same results. I pulled the lifters and they are Jims hydraulic units. I checked the oil passages and they are all clear and the oil holes appear to be facing the right way. Is there a way to check or test the lifters to confirm they are the problem? I am considering converting to solids. Any advise would be greatly appreciated.
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#2

Post by Cotten »

Otis!
I know nothing of JIMS lifters, but...

Two causes for OEM lifters immediately come to mind:
The first is when the tappet to guide clearance is so great that the oil bleeds by instead of finding its way into that little hole in the tappet. Honing the guide to fit an oversize tappet is the cure.

The other prominent cause of lifter collapse, particularly at idle on a hot engine, is andrews A-grind cams.

....Cotten
VintageTwin
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#3

Post by VintageTwin »

Go to solids. They worked on Knuckles. They work on Pans. Pushrod lash adjustment is a metronome of living. Every oil change you get the opportunity to atone your inner self. When your pushrods are adjusted, you know you're in control of your motor, not JIMS or Cranes control. He who adjust his own pushrods is closer to god. Pure and simple. Don't trust your mill to "modern technology". "Modern" won't help you when they start ticking and/or losing "pump" ability. 8)
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#4

Post by Cotten »

Just for clarity,
Pans never had solids.

...Cotten
VintageTwin
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#5

Post by VintageTwin »

From the history of the first ones in '48-52 they should have :!:
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#6

Post by Cotten »

Agreed.
But Otis has a '58 with a well proven design.

I'm still waiting to hear if it's andrews cam agony.

....Cotten
VPH-D
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#7

Post by VPH-D »

Actually, the 48-52 models had solid lifters and hydraulic pushrods. Kinda picky, but Cotten is correct, Pans never had solids like Knuckles and Sportsters.
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#8

Post by rigidpanman »

true,but they should have...solids forever!!!!!
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#9

Post by King »

Hi Cotten

Just curious, but how do Andrews cams cause "agony".

Thanks

King
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#10

Post by fourthgear »

I'm with the solid lifter folks, the low flow and low pressure are not a good inviroment for early Hyd. systems. Ya just never know when they are working correctly or not. Solids may not be as good for the valve trane , but when adj. correctly , you know they are working and I do believe they do add a touch of performance.
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#11

Post by Cotten »

King!

Discounting the agonies of andrew's quality problems in decades past (I am told they last longer now..) the A grind ramps are just not sufficient to keep the lifters loaded at low r's when hot.

Andrews will lie bare-assed about this if you call them. I did.

Highvolume oilpumps seem to alleviate the problem somewhat.....

For pre-53 machines I suggest solids of course, as the original pushrod units werre horrendous. But later hydraulics proved themselves from '53 to '84.
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#12

Post by SkyHogg »

Just for the record, I've been using solids in my '64 Duo since around 1980, and they have served me well. I'm not recommending anything to anyone else, but in my case since it ain't broke I ain't fixin' it.
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#13

Post by VPH-D »

I've always been a solid lifter fan, never had a Big Twin with hydraulics. Works for me.
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#14

Post by VintageTwin »

I put 26K miles on my '59 motor, before I pulled the machine apart. Use Colony's hydraulic-to-solid tappet conversion kits. Checked the pushrod lash every 3,000 miles when I changed the oil. Found that my pushrods never went out of adjustment. Was always able to spin the push rod selected, by laying one finger against the rod and spinning slowly trying to feel any drag. Adjusted the front intake a couple of times just because I couldn't believe it didn't need it. When the threads get tight on the pushrod adjuster (at the couple of threads where the nuts are continually tightened), I replace the (split) adjuster nuts. The motor might get a little noisy when the motor heats up, but a little loose on the push rods, is way better than a little tight.
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#15

Post by Cotten »

Geez thats loose.


Seriously.


...Cotten
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