Best hydraulic lifter

[Rammy]

Wondering what is one of the best hydraulic lifters to use in the stk lifter blocks ? what you guys have had good luck with, I would like to run the A cam from Andrews. Also is it common to have so much slop between the hyd insert and the lifter body ? the ones I run have a good .015 of slop dosn`t seem right...

[Cotten]

Rammy!

You can't go wrong with OEM, if you can find serviceable ones.

As far as modern issue, be cautious with ones stamped "D I Y" (or something like that. Its been a couple of years, but the Japanese variety were the best I could find at one time, even though Eaton (the OEM manufacturer) was also reproducing them. (Crane may still be re-packaging the good ones, maybe.)

Slop in the tappets was enough concern that the Factory potted them in in the early 80's. Without knowing the exact compound, I cannot endorse that idea today. We all b*tched about it when it came time to service them.

I have no experience with modern alternative designs, and don't expect to.

Sorry there is no real helpful content to this post.

....Cotten

[Rammy]

Cotton
The lifters that I run Have DIT stamped on them I think from Japan.
With J cam they work ok most of the time but at fast idle when cold to partly warm the front exhaust will klak a bit and you can here it in the tail pipe , when hot they seem to be ok. I changed that lifter and still same thing. The front exhaust seems to have the most angle on it . Why that one only, has got me. Maybe oil flow not good to that one......

[Cotten]

Rammy!

The profile on the cam may have some effect as well, since andrews will swear to your face that their "A" will work with hydraulics, and it does not.

All of these effects usually add up when the motor is warm and at idle, however.

....Cotten

[Rammy]

I`m wondering if any body knows of a manufacture of lifter body and inserts that have a good fit , just dosn`t seem right that the hyd. insert should Jingle around in the lifter body?

[VPH-D]

IIRC, we were instructed in the mid-late 70s to loctite the hydraulic unit into the tappet body. We were also to recommend the use of only H D 75 oil in later Shovels with hydraulic lifters.

I don't think Andrews cams are meant to run with anything but solids, either.
VPH-D

[Rammy]

Anybody seen those Sifton maxie axle lifters that are all one piece lifter and hyd. all made together like a car lifter , that seens like a good idea. How about the Velva touch setup?

[partshunt]

I installed one piece lifters in my 54FL. I believe they are shovelhead and are fine and run well. There also is a noise sometimes at the front lifter at idle but bear in mind that its the last lifter unit downstream relying on the original cast pump of 1954 so I cant complain. down the road its fine once its off idle. It also needs to idle for a while after a good run to get a bit noisy. I do hear a noise in the rocker cover near the intakes that has a different sound with a tone to it like rocker covers radiating rocker arm noise. No felts in the covers doesnt help either. I didnt have info on a better bonding agent than the factory used which eventually the felts came off on the original oem set up.....partshunt

[Rammy]

Partshunt,
I also have a front lifter tick a little at hot idle with stk pump , I was thinking last in line to get oil too. That front lifter also has a little trouble staying pumped up when cold even after changeing it ...... I bet a higher volume pump would help keep better oil flow to the lifters.. What cam are you running?

[partshunt]

Hey Rammy:- My problem is I'm too much of a purist when it comes to restoring an oldie. Not saying they are a hundred percent cuz I go sometimes with what I have till better or correct coes along, then I try to take the window for correct. Being a purist, I just went with a stock FL cam in this 54FL. FLH cams came in 55 or 56I believe with the big "H' on the oil tank. These old panheads were ok when a kid back in 57 so why bother macking em go faster, hell, if I want fast I take out the TC88 for a good run. To me the shovelhead pump just dont go for apearance so I went with the stock cast pump. Be a good thing if someone built a better cast pump, I'd use it if it looked stock. Harley put out about 46 or 4800 FLs in 54, musta been good enough for most people including the police service so I'm ok with it as was.....

Further on lifter noise, especially the front one furthest from the pump is critically far downstream from the stock pump of the early fifties FL's. Anywhere in the engine where oil pressure can spill from clearances a bit more than originally built into the engine at the factory can cause a loss at the furthest point from the pump. Even using a three hole crankpin can effect a given engine I believe. Maybe not all but it seems to me, as soon as you deviate from stock in one area, it can effect another area. More lube in one spot, has to lead to less oil elswhere unless you compensate with a larger pump, nothing is free. Modifications can be a problem and one modification ussually needs another to compensate an effected area elswhere. My thoughts for what its worth...

Joe

[Rammy]

Joe,
I agree with you on not wanting to change the stock look of Things , My bike is a near stk 51FL . I would have trouble going to an aftermarket type oil pump as you say when you change one thing you end up changing other parts to make it fit. like oil lines and stuff. To bad somebody didn`t make a high volume geer set for the cast stk pump just to make sure oil was getting to the outer limits

[partshunt]

Rammy:- I think with the older pushrod lifters, the engineers at the factory were happy and satisfied with them and they worked fine for coupla years in a tight engine, new conditition from 1948 to 52. Since those pushrod lifters were fed from the overhead passage thru the rocker shafts then down the rocker arm socket to the lifter itself filling it down ward. The circuit worked fine for the engineers and for a coupla years till you had enough hours accumulated on the engine, then the problems started. It started because of rocker arm wear at the shafts and scored sockets, all causing spill off depriving the lifter. Even the oil pump was not in new condition any longer either after a coupla years of use. The factory had to scrap the design because engines had to be in top shape for a longer period and they just gave em headackes in early hour engines.So I dont always fault the lifter but the rest of the engine condition is imortant. The oil supply to the lifters is so critical on those pan heads that the rest of the engine needs to be in top condition fit wise where oil pressure and volume is effected. If the lifter when cleaned up dry and the plunger is inserted to compress air and bounces back, that tells me the lifter is fine, it most certaintly will hold oil if it can compress air in a clean and dry test just as the shop manual describes how to qualify the lifter itself. If the dry test is good on a noisy lifter, check for oil loss elswhere. It requires a steady supply with no air or interuptions. Some lifters leak off standing with the 400 pund valve spring bleeding it empty, thats normal as long as they refill in a few minutes but air sometimes is hard to get rid off and then the engine needs a good run to clear. Happens to auto engines even those modern babys of today.....Joe

[fourthgear]

When you say , change one thing and it effects another , I have an S&S oil pump and if you want to remove the flat exh. pipe under the motor between the front exh. and the two into one exh. pipe , I have to lift the motor . Of course how often do you remove this pipe , probably only when you do engine work , like removing it ,but it is some thing to think about when you change pumps for more flow.

[Rammy]

Hi Joe,
I here what you are saying about the hyd pushrods , good points..... But I have carefully drilled oil passage's to supply the later style lifter blocks so I can run the hyd units in them on my 51 .

[partshunt]

Hi Rammy:- Been away from the site a while so late to reply. Just want to say that drilling out the passages as you have done is a great accomplishment considering any mistake can ruin your cases. I have never done one, not brave enough I guese. It would be a very tense and nerve destructing time if I were to attempt it, congrats on a fine job to get it all functioning so well...Joe