48 Panhead after six years of restoration...

[JB_48Pan]

Hello all,

after six long years I've finished up now restoration of my 48 Panhead, which I've bought really desolated, looking somewhat like a trashbin, and now the real trouble starts.

I've used the expensive high-tech james cylinder-base-metal-gaskets and I've got the same oil-leakage-problem like other bikers in this forum: Rear cylinder-feed-line is not tight. This will force me to open up the engine again to have this changed. I think I will use this original paper-ones with some type of sealing. Hope this will help.

What I've also read about is this famous float for linkert-carbs made by Cotten. But where can I buy these, when ordering from germany? At the moment I've got a brass one and it seems to be working, but engine has run only two times after overhauling.

Last question: What is the right or ideal way to kickstart an old harley-davidson? I've got some problems to have it started. Sometimes it bangs, sometimes it kicks back and two times I've got it running, but cannot really remember how I did this. From what position will it be the best to kick? Are there some old-school-bikers here who can advise someone who is only used to electric starting?

I've already restored a shovel FLH and actually driving a 11-year-old FLHR Road King. The Panhead really looks best, but I really want to ride it as soon as possible.

Thanks for your help.

Jost

[panhead]

Jost,

Welcome to the forum. You can contact Cotten directly by email (liberty@npoint.net). Delivery to Germany only takes a few days.

[awander]

I'm not an "old-school biker", but I do have a couple of pans, and I can tell you what works(well) to start my '52 FL with Linkert M-74.

With the ignition off, retard the spark about halfway.

Close the choke fully and kick the bike over 3 times.

Open the choke fully, and then close it one kick.

Move the kicker with your foot so it is on a compression stroke.

Open the throttle all the way.(You may get better results with the throttle only partway open-mine needs to be fully open)

Turn the ignition ON, and kick it hard.

It should start right up.

Once it starts, take the choke off and advance the ignition all the way.

Let us know how it works.

Got pictures?

[Cotten]

Jost!

I can get a float into the mail as soon as you post me directly, thanks.

Meanwhile, 'kicking back' is one of the many different symptoms that a small vacuum leak can cause.

Please test your manifold assembly with ~1 atmosphere of pressure as described at http://virtualindian.org/11techleaktest.html

Beware that even the pancover screws over each intake port can sometimes be an unsuspected leak.

If you find no bubbles under pressure, then we can go on to other tuning variables.
Good luck!

....Cotten

[JB_48Pan]

Thanks so far for your advice.

@Andy: Yes there are some pics. I've uploaded them to the gallery:
http://www.hydra-glide.com/coppermine/d ... t=0&pos=14
http://www.hydra-glide.com/coppermine/d ... t=0&pos=13

What I did so far to get it running was:

open throttle and close choke fully,
fully retard ignition,
kicking three times,
close throttle and open it abt. 1/4 turn,
open choke fully,
looking for a cylinder on compression stroke,
position the kickstarter on abt. 9:00 h,
ignition on and kicking hardly
after starting ignition to full advance

Two times the engines starts and runs fine and smoothly but just when wanting to start adjusting the carb, I've discovered this oil-leakage at the rear cylinder-base where the feed-line is located. I've used these metal-gaskets from james and firstly wanted to tighten up the base nuts before letting it run again. After doing this, I was not able to start it again, because when looking for compression stroke, it tends now to kick back, perhaps I'm kicking not hard enough. I've already thought about starting it with the ignition not fully retarded, but then I've read that this would increase kicking back. Perhaps I should try this like you've proposed. Is it really right to have the kicker on 9:00-h-position when kicking or would it be better to have it on 10:00 h or 7:00 h?

@Cotten: I will contact you directly for the float. I've already thought about air-leakages but couldn't imagine it so far, because the heads have been overhauled by a HD-engine-specialist, he also put in the flanges for the manifold. The manifold is new the brass-rings are new and the gasket to the carb is new. But, anyway, I have to remove heads and cylinders for changing the base-gaskets and then I will test the intake for leakages in the way, you've described, just to be sure to be aware of that phenomenon. Do you also sell the plates where the air-hoses are connected also for a linkert M-35-flange?

Jost

[awander]

I am not sure where the kick lever is when I get th compression stroke-but I always try to have it as high as possible wehn doing so-so I will get more engine revs out of a kick.

Are you sure your timing is set correctly? mine will not kicj back at all with the timing retarded only halfway.

[Panacea]

Are you sure the timing is set correctly? It shouldn't "kick back" unless you're a bit advanced. I agree those metal base gaskets don't work. When you replace the base gaskets keep in mind you may have to rotate the cylinders a bit to alighn the intake manifold, so maybe a little grease would work better than sealer. Mike

[awander]

JOst:

Your photo links don;t work.

[xnoahx]

Sounds like your starting procedure is solid, Ill do about the same, 3 kicks with near full choke to prime, turn on ignition full retard and kick with 1/4-1/2 throttle and it fires right up

[JB_48Pan]

I've adjusted timing exactly according to the HD-panhead-workshop-manual and I've rechecked this. I'm quite sure that timing is ok. It really seems that I've got a lack of practise. I will carry on trying with the kicker as high as possible. I think that was the way I've got it running for the first time. Then I read from someone in this forum that it would be better and easier to start from the 8:00-h-position. That didn't work at all.

@Andy: Seems that someone (the admin?) made changes to the links, so that they cannot be used directly anymore. You can find the photos when searching for the filenames PA270003a and PA270005a in the gallery.

@ Mike: using grease is also the way that I would prefer instead of using sealer, but I'm not quite sure whether this will be enough. I've installed a S&S pump just to have more pressure for using the original pushrods with the hydros on the top. To avoid flooding the heads with oil, a tiny sleeve has been installed in the feedline on the cylinder-base. All these has been done by the HD-motor-specialist and I've assembled the parts afterwards. The result are that the hydros in the pushrods are working perfectly (they've been quiet after a few seconds) but also a higher pressure on the feed-lines. That was the reason for me to use metal base-gaskets - just to avoid what I've got now. I'm a bit scared of the paper-base-gaskets becoming untight as well when not using them together with a sealer.

Jost

[panhead]

Seems that someone (the admin?) made changes to the links, so that they cannot be used directly anymore

You did not make a link to the right URL.

Here they are:

http://www.hydra-glide.com/coppermine/d ... ?pos=-1552
http://www.hydra-glide.com/coppermine/d ... ?pos=-1551

[JB_48Pan]

You did not make a link to the right URL.

Hmm... I've tried it after posting, but - anyway - thanks for your help.

By the way: I've discovered that I was already registered to the forum. That makes chatting much more comfortable.

Jost

[Kuda]

That was the reason for me to use metal base-gaskets - just to avoid what I've got now. I'm a bit scared of the paper-base-gaskets becoming untight as well when not using them together with a sealer.

Had the same problem, here's what fixed it: Used small brass cylinders, pressed into the oil holes in the bottom of the cylinders, then drilled out the cylinders with a slightly offset (to the inside) hole. End result: more surface area for the gasket to grip on, and no more leaks. Oh, and I used James paper gaskets, installed dry.
Tried the metal gaskets twice, same leaky results. As far as I'm concerned, they're junk.

-Kuda
'49 panchop